Pervert

[Vtybjqkukilmq]

Yes, I agree, but if you choose to go down the 'holding one's personal data' route, the same theory would also apply to any data base holding personal details. Beauticians, hairdressers and so on.

I must say, this topic interested me so much today that I took it upon myself to do a bit of extra research on the subject. I'm not sure if I'm allowed to post it here (it's of a sexual nature) but there is already a data base running holding clients details in the "other" type of massage industry. When I say already running, I'm not sure if it's legal or not but it's all there for one to see.

 

[mike70025]

tuliplady,i can't believe that you inferred massaging bottoms should be left to another profession!

Did you have any views on the matter before being told by your tutor that it's a no-go area? You still seem to be under her influence despite the collective wisdom here.Or have intransigent views?

If a client asks for work on his/her hypertonic piriformis will you assume he is a pervert?

Heaven forbid if he asks if he need to keep his undercrackers on or not.

Is there a password protected online data base listing all those itec trained therapists who refuse to do glute work,with their reasons why and the name of their itec tutor?

Is this just related to male clients?

I have lost count of the number of females who have asked me to work on their bottoms,as you put it.

I treated one lady at an event who wanted me to work her glutes only for the full duration.I think I did some good work.

She was a WPC...Luckily I wasn't arrested!

 

[Franz]

Yes it does which is why we should all be aware that client notes shouldn't contain anything you wouldn't want them to see.

Also presumably beauticians, hairdressers etc don't often label people as perverts. Or maybe they do?

Back to the glutes debate. How can we deal with common conditions like sciatica without working into the glutes/piriformis? And surely it's the trainer's job to teach people to do this with confidence & professionalism?
Jx

 

[Pompal 09.]

I agree Jinx, I've just been trained in Holistic Massage (ITEC/BTEC) which covered the glutes thoroughly. I STILL would like to know what VTCT thinks about a tutor at one of its accredited training institutions teaching their students that massage of the glutes is to be avoided because it gives men erections!!

Tuliplady – can’t help feeling you’re focussing on the wrong thing. You’re perfectly entitled not to want to massage other people’s glutes, and there’s absolutely nothing wrong with setting your own personal boundaries – that should be part of your training - as long as you don’t believe that those who do massage the glutes are not perverted, nor are those who like having their glutes massaged. It simply means they're less narrow-minded than you Same for naked massage, illustrated very eloquently many times in this thread, a client who likes a massage while naked and/or a massage therapist who is fine massaging naked clients, can be entirely professional – but if it’s not your boat, then simply don’t float it. As I said before, if you're training at a professional massage training institution (and I am not convinced that you are given the misinformation provided by your tutor!), then you will be trained not to expose your client whether they wear pants or not, anyway.

I can't help wondering, based on everything you've said, whether massage is the right industry for you.

@ coolhandluke - you do make me laugh, you have a way with words! By the way, when you say you don't like having your pants on for massage, do you mean that the therapist massages your glutes through them, instead of pulling them down Never heard of such a thing!

 

[J man]

I'm currently doing VTCT Aroma at college. Our tutor told us to never massage a man's abdomen as it's too much of a sensitive area. So, this is something that a lot of tutors are passing on to students.

One lady in the class asked if it was OK to practise the abdomen routine on a man outside of college as part of home-study. The tutor gave her a withering look & replied, "... Only if it's your husband."

Glutes aren't being taught as part of the routine but I wouldn't have imagined they would have been. The college used to teach Sports Therapy but no longer does - I guess glute work was covered there. They do Swedish but only as part of the full time complementary cert. & beauty therapy (I'm certain they wouldn't cover glutes in either). We were told that the college does frequently have to turn away men who asked for their buttocks to be massaged.

Funnily enough I was at my class last night & was chatting with one of the other students (who incidentally doesn't actually believe Aroma works). She said how she hates doing the abdomen massage because she thinks it's "weird". Her actual comment was, "Why the hell do we have to learn to massage someone's stomach? If I was going for a massage I would never dream of asking for it. I think people who want it done are just... well... a bit weird."

She then went on to say how much she like to get into Sport's Therapy

Another female student was bricking it when we started taking in clients as her fella would go "F****** MENTAL!" if she had to massage a man.

It boggles my mind why half of the sudents have paid a hefty sum to do this course when this is their attitude.

 

[Halesfielda]

As Jinx says, yes it does, whatever you practice.

Clients I've had provide their details and sign the paperwork which indicates clearly that the details will be held in a secure cabinet (under lock and key) and not stored electronically, and will be securely destroyed (shredded) 12 months (or whatever period is chosen) after the last treatment, subject to there being no legal reason to hold the records; and that if they have any issues or questions regarding their treatment they are responsible for discussing those with me within a reasonable time after the treatement (i.e. they can't leave it a couple of years and then claim they were mis-treated after I've destroyed the documentation).

If the details are stored on a computer (database, spreadsheet or whatever) then you get more involved in the realms of the data protection act and have to ensure that the data is stored securely and cannot be accessed by just anyone gaining access to the machine etc. which can be a minefield if you're not careful.

I know a lot of therapists who just store their clients details on a spreadsheet on their computer that isn't password protected and their computer has little protection from being accessed by external persons i.e. hackers or visitors to their home, or if the machine is stolen. They're clearly in breach of the data protection act, but seem to care little about it; though it would be a major problem for them if something were to happen to that data.

All I can say is, be careful and ensure you understand peoples rights in respect of their data. It's for your own benefit.

All Love and Reiki Hugs

 

[Abby Kim]

OK, that's it. Time for action!

I've just emailed VTCT asking them if these tutors are reflecting VTCT policy. Wonder if they'll reply?

 

[Leafsfan29-Go Canada Go]

Hi all
I have been following this thread since it started, and many others similar about glutes etc. and have to confess, I am one of those who was trained with a basic stomach routine (which I have since tried to greatly improve) and absolutely nothing above mid thigh. So, how do I learn to do a more effective massage, and as I massage a number of people, both men and women, who use the gym and run and clearly it would be beneficial to them.
Thanks
Love Melanie x

 

[NeoftNecobmEt]

Well either find a CPD training that covers that area, or perhaps find someone who did do all-areas training and see if they'll coach you (maybe a swap?)

 

[staisil]

I've read with thread with a mix of horror and fascination. Although I no longer do body therapies, I trained in 1993, and we were blythly told to 'try not to touch the pubes' and other than female breasts, everything was covered. Or uncovered, as the case might be. I have a lasting memory of the tutor informing one shy woman that 'we were all Jock Tampson's bairns - no place for modesty here'. LOL. Although to be fair, we spent a lot of time on draping 'but no wafting the towel about lassie - firm and decisive!'

 

[Tiara A]

Jock must get quite a bill from the Child Support Agency!

 

[MariVi]

The main course tutor on my course told us that the majority of her work at her local hospital is abdomen work, for relieving constipation/sluggish digestive systems, for patients who are lying down all day and need a boost to their peristalsis. Makes sense to me! I can see that might be a stretch if your own vision of massage is purely for relaxation/pampering in a pretty health spa/salon, but the environment that I see myself working in is more therapeutic.

I have found lots of people on the Holistic Massage element of my course are just doing it for 'something to do', and not taking it that seriously, not putting the practise in outside class, and thus giving thoroughly pants (pardon the pun) massage to fellow students while in class! There only seemed to be a few of us who had our heads screwed on and wanted to make a career out of this.

Looking at some of the comments, I've clearly been very lucky to have great tutors at a thoroughly professional school.

@ Richard - please let us know if VTCT respond

 

[The Aromatherapist.]

I think it's not only the 'something to do' thing but also a fantasy that massage is all nice and fluffy - sort of like a soft-focus film of stroking a little kitten (no hidden pun intended ) in a summer meadow full of flowers and butterflies. Faced with the reality of flesh - eeugh! They recoil. I guess there may be a genuine desire to connect with others in some way - but for such people skin-on-skin is probably not best for them.

 

[[killer]kelli.(:]

Definetely agree there. Also another reason massage therapists don't practice...........the realities of that nasty,nasty,nasty thing




dare I say....






those words.......





business acumen



Patchouli

 

[tron]

Should be ashamed of yourself, using dirty language like that.

 

[Ms Take]

Business acumen? Now that is a perversion!

Whatever happened to love n light, angels, cosmic ordering direct (every little bit helps..)?

 

[ladyhorde4]

And I try to practice them all.......just not all of them at the same time

Nah seriously guys, if I had a £ for all the people who have come through the door wanting to do massage (but don't like exerting themselves, get a bit hot from hard work or have the time and effort to market themselves) I would be very rich indeed.

Patchouli

 

[Pegasus P]

You're right, Patchouli. When I first trained in massage, our tutor actually said if you think that being a professional massage therapist is all sweetness and light - think again. He really did try and inject some reality into people's thinking. I wonder how many organisations are actually that honest?

 

[Sister]

Hi all,

Sorry not been on the forum for a while and boy has this thread got bigger
As I said earlier on I am quite happy to massage clients nakid and undraped but can be looked upon in disgust by other therapies. Then reading further comments has only highlighted this by being likened to a prostitute. This really does make me sad as all I want to do is provide the best MASSAGE service for my clients and if they feel more comfortable undraped then so be it. As others have said the human body is not something to be ashamed of or thought of as nasty and disgusting to touch and this country is very backward in the way the body is viewed. As I said in my previous post I do have a line I will not cross, I massage high up into the thigh and groin area, buttocks and stomach but will not massage the genital area. I find these areas really important to massage especially if the client does a lot of sports and also if the client sits down a lot for their job (get alot of taxi drivers and they find such a relief in having their glutes done). I do appreciate you can get some guys wanting a bit more and I have had my fair share of these calls but you learn to deal with them and move on to people who genuinaly want your help.

I hope that the genuine client out their finds the therapist most suited to their needs (and in doing so is not branded as a pervert) and therapists I hope you all attract the type of clients you want to treat and all is well with your businesses and harmony and balance prevails in the universe.
Love and Light
Karen
Agelic Reiki Master and Holistic Practitioner
xxx

 

[susudio]

Hi All

I have been reading this thread with absolute fascination. It does of course overlap into other earlier threads.

Once upon a time I discovered massage and enjoyed it. I therefore experimented with different massage styles and therapists. I disovered that some therapies either encouraged or required nudity - but would compromise if I was not comfortable with that. It was/is fine with me.

I then discovered that some therapies/therapists included longer whole of body movements in their routines which only really worked with a nude body.

Once upon a time i discovered that I liked masage so much that I wanted to learn how to do it myself. I was lucky that I did not go to a college course but had 1 to 1 lessons from a lovely tutor who (almost) required nudity. So I learned massage with none of the strange shame of the human body that has been reflected in this threads headline. I have subsequently learned to massage with drapes but it was not how I was taught. And as far as my biased views are concerned you get a far better massage if there is nothing in the way. And if you are seeking to avoid certain bits ! it is far easier if you can see what you are doing.

But the really sad thing is I must be a sexual pervert because when i am discussing massage with others, either with a view to arranging an exchange, or just to receive I am scared stiff of expressing my views about massage and nudity/underwear/drapes and worst of all what bits will be included or excluded. So I dare not ask over the phone.

I do explore these issues when face to face and seem to have got away with that so far.

And if any of you are looking at the swaps thread, I will not impose my beliefs on you, I will work to the lowest ( or is it highest) common denominator - if you want me/you to wear undies and/or be draped as well so be it. if you want to give or receive a lower quality massage that is your choice. But I would like to feel free to ask questions and express my own views without being labelled as a sexual pervert#

Pistols at dawn on Saturday morning - if the trains or motorways to teh duelling gerounds are open