Vivastreet new policy on naturist massage ads

[Pepsi C]

I have been advertising on Vivastreet for quite a few months with no problems. I offer naturist-style massage as an option if clients wish (ie naked and undraped). However, it's certainly not a prerequisite.

However, I've had an email from Vivastreet saying that from now on all naturist massages MUST go under the "Erotic Massages" section in the Over 18 Category!!!

I am really disappointed in the narrow-mindedness of this decision. Whilst I realise that there possibly ARE therapists out there who use "naturist massage" as a euphemism for something a bit more dodgy, that CERTAINLY isn't what I do.

There's no way I want to advertise in the Erotic Massage section because that will just mean I will be flooded with inappropriate requests. It's so frustrating.

Should I try explaining to Vivastreet my position, or would I be flogging a dead horse?

I know people have strong opinions against massaging a naked, undraped body. But I am very relaxed with nakedness, and I feel that I give a much better massage when I get to work with the whole body all at once - ie lots of long sweeping strokes up and down the whole length of the body (not possible if there are towels or underwear in the way). My clients find it both highly relaxing and liberating.

Has anyone else come up against this with Vivastreet? What would you do in my position?

Thanks in advance for any advice. And my apologies if this post offends anyone. I realise that what I do is slightly contentious, but it is not sexual in any way (although perhaps admittedly sensual - but I feel those are different things).

Kitten
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[Zahid]

Hi Kitten

I think you misunderstand the term naturist massage where both parties are undressed for the massage, just allowing the person who is receiving the massage to be undraped with nothing on is not a naturist massage it is just a massage.

Hope that helps.

 

[bubbley]

From experience with vivastreet in the past I know that they don't allow links to websites in their ads. I've tried inserting the html but it doesn't come up as a link. I've also tried to reason with them in the past to no avail. So I wouldn't hold out too much hope in getting very far with them. Have you tried Gumtree?

 

[Churro]

I get much more traffic from gumtree and there is no problem with links! When you advertise massage on gumtree, you have to state your credentials and say that it's not sexual!

 

[parisa]

Thank you for all the replies.

Paul/Anduril, yes I do understand that there is a difference between true naturist massage and the kind of massage that I offer. I tend to refer to it as 'naturist-style' in my ad, and I always state a disclaimer that I will not be naked during the massage (just in case there's any confusion). For some reason it's really not common at all to provide undraped massage in Glasgow (or Scotland) - and yet many people prefer it. So I saw this as a way to have a 'unique selling point'.

Melanie, thanks for the tip about Gumtree. I've given them a try in the past, but even the mention of undraped massage caused my ad to be removed by the moderators (they are very strict there).

In the meantime I've tried with Freeads. So I'll see how that goes. I've got the usual statements about "this is a strictly professional, non-sexual service" in the ad, so I should hopefully not have too many problems.

It's funny, despite advertising as providing naturist (or naturist-style) massage, I haven't actually had too many weird or offensive requests from clients. And even when I do get the odd "do you offer extras" request I just chalk it up to guys chancing their arm. I don't honestly think they mean any harm. They probably just think "if you don't ask, you don't get". So I don't take it personally.

Kitten
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[lysistrata411]

Hi Kitten

Just save yourself a lot of advertising difficulties by just advertising yourself as a massage therapist, the amount of clothing or draping used during the massage is largely irrelevant to what you do, that is just down to personal preferences.

You might also find that some people will be put off by an advert for naturist style massage, so unless you are offering a naturist massage which is unique to the people who offer it, then you are only doing what most massage therapist do and being flexible to accommodate people's personal preferences in a professional way.

At the end of the day, you will be judged on the quality of the massages that you give more than anything else.

 

[gazeygoo]

Have you got a well established client base or are you starting out? The reason I ask is that as far as I am concerned, a client deciding on a massage therapist on their style of of draping is a bit of a rather small concern in what a massage can offer. Sure it can help the flow, but after a while you will be amazed at how it makes no difference to the flow, depending on how you do it (I'd say try lomi lomi draping and it doesn't make any difference) Once you are busy enough to not be too worried about getting new clients, advertising isn't as much of a concern, and word of mouth does a lot more, but there you need a good sized client base to do that.

I'd suggest stick to the therapist section and don't mention draping/naturist. I can say this from the saftey of a large client base, but I do remember what it was like when there wasn't that client base.

 

[nsw]

I have to say that I find the approach of VivaStreet quite astounding. If you click on the VS Massage section for London, you may not find the word "naturist" in the text of the adverts, but you do find it top of the "quick links" sidebar!!

The other offerings in what is frequently a dodgy set of folk include (just out of the first few I looked at)!!:

"Hot Thai massage !!.with Hot Girl ....NEW AT STRATFORD (with bikini clad girl in attendance on photo);

"hi, im yolanda, im attractive eastern european therapist offering complete relaxation to sooth all your tesions. massage is for gentlemen only." and

"Male massage student offer Sensual Massage for Ladies..."


What planet are they on? This approach of VS reflects the ever present (and offensive) automatic confusion between nudity and sexuality. Sometimes I despair ....

 

[Somebody]

I would adive exactly as paul has above, don't advertise as a naturist style massage, I think it will actually put some potential clients off.

When yo meet during the consultation you can say to them its up to themselves if the wish to leave underwear on or not.

I think you will get more people through the door and then they can decide which ever they prefer.

 

[Ol Jackrabbit]

Hi Paul

I agree that I might just be making things more difficult for myself by pursuing this type of advertising. I guess I just genuinely feel that there is a gap in the market in my area for therapists willing to provide undraped massage.

But you're right (and it's something I'd not considered till now) I'm possibly putting some people off choosing me. Admittedly, a large percentage of my client base is male, so perhaps women are put off by my mentioning nudity in relation to massage?

I think I will try to get the best of both worlds by placing two seperate adverts - one which mentions undraped massage (because I still feel that it is a selling point) and one which just mentions swedish and deep tissue massage.

Thanks again for taking the time to reply.

Kitten
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[Jane Smith]

Hi Cola

Yes, fortunately I do have a well established client base. But I occasionally find that some regulars fall away (sometimes for financial reasons, some moved away, some got fed-up not being able to get an appointment at short-notice - Oops! etc etc), so I still want to find new clients to ensure that I maintain a comfortable level of income.

With regards to the level of draping making a difference, well I guess I can only go by what my clients tell me. And that is that it makes a big difference to them. Perhaps they've had bad massages in the past where the moving and replacement of towels has been the final straw in making the experience unpleasant? They also have complained about the fact that during a draped massage they usually only get a partial leg massage (almost as if the thigh muscles stop 3/4 of the way up the leg!! LOL) whereas I make sure that all relevant muscles get the proper attention.

Also, and this is just a personal perspective - I used to feel self-conscious being naked in front of another person (even boyfriends!). But I started doing some massage exchanges while I was still training, and that's when I first discovered the idea that massages COULD be undraped/naked. At first I was horrified by the idea, but also slightly curious.

The first time I tried it I was nervous, but that soon passed. And now I find that it has made me much more relaxed (and liberated) with my own body. I won't say that I have any plans to become a naturist myself! LOL! But I do know that I always feel much more relaxed having an undraped massage than a draped one.

Thanks again for your comments.

Kitten
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[SteexyFes]

Kitten,

I have read the various comments with interest. From a receiver's point of view, I think that your honesty and openness about offering naked/uncovered massage is refreshing.

I also quite agree that draped massage is often only partial (at best). My own experience of naked/undraped massage began when I was a keen cyclist and a member of a club. Inevitably I picked up various knee injuries etc and was referred to a (female) physio/masseuse who treated many of my clubmates.

She explained that she would need to work on glutes, piriformis, quads, hamstrings and adductors, and said that she would prefer to work on me naked & without towels etc, so she could get at all areas easily. Rather like you, I was rather horrified at first, but after a couple of sessions I stopped worrying about it. Quite a few years later, I still think that naked/uncovered massage is preferable to draped.

I have been lucky to find therapists who are open-minded and are prepared to work in this way, and have been seeing the same therapist now for about 10 years. At one point she made it clear on her website that she offered naked/undraped massage, but after a while she dropped this when her site was revised. She said that this was to stop nuisance calls, of which she had a few. But interestingly, she said that she had never had any trouble from a client who had actually made an appointment and received a treatment - no-one had made inappropriate requests etc. I am not sure that any general lesson can be drawn from this, but I thought it interesting.

Take care, and good luck.

 

[Mercedes]

As it's down to client preference I would change the wording.
How dare they suggest you belong in the erotic section!

 

[Paul W]

This youtube video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSUf_ihxYVk is of the style of draping I mentioned (lomi lomi) How anyone can complain that that prevents anything getting worked on that that needs to get worked on in a therapeutic session, I don't understand (same style is used face up) I've learnt few massage modalities with this style of draping. Many forms of Ayurvedic massage have the same draping, Abyhanga in particular.

The only training I have done were towels were used was my original massage qualification, all post-graduate training I have done has used sheets, from full size to lomi lomi sizing, or been clothed.

 

[Susana]

I'm with you Cola. I use the Lomi style of draping in all my treatments unless the client request otherwise. However, I'm attending a 'Hands Free' course this coming weekend and have been told that I must bring towels not sheets or sarongs which did surpirise me.

 

[~JuliaGulia~]

Thanks for the link Cola. Lomi Lomi looks absolutely amazing! I must try to arrange an appointment somewhere to experience it. But you're right, that style of draping certainly offers the flexibility to reach all required areas.

On a separate note, I just tried to place my advert on Gumtree (mentioning "naturist-style" draping) and Gumtree have blocked the advert. They state that they will not allow adverts for "Erotic, sensual or naturist massages"!!! WHY oh WHY oh WHY do people seem to bundle naturist in with the seedier side of massage?!!

I realise that what I offer is NOT a "real" naturist massage (which you would think would make mine more "tame" by comparison surely?!). But what about all the people who DO offer genuine naturist massage. They are being discriminated against in the worst possible way.

Not much I can do except fume silently I suppose.

Kitten
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[sincerely, kristyn.]

Hi Kitten. Why not advertise 'undraped massage' as this is what you are actually offering rather than a naturist massage. There is enough confusion around the general public regarding naturist massage without us therapists adding to that confusion. I'm not 'having a go' Kitten, just trying to offer a solution that may be acceptable to the people you are trying to advertise with and not confuse Joe public.

 

[Brian Liebman]

Hi Bodywork

Thanks for your suggestion, I appreciate it. However, I have actually already tried to resubmit an advert on Vivastreet simply mentioning undraped - and removed any mention of naturist - and they STILL rejected it.

So it seems to be the very AWFUL(!) suggestion of massaging a naked body that they manage to equate to eroticism!

It's so annoying.

Thanks again for your advice.

Kitten
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[George C]

Have you got your own website? That's probably the easiest way to explain what you are offerring. Might be time to invest in one. If you already have a website and it's not working for you, maybe you just need some tips on search engine optimization?

 

[josey]

Kitten, I think sometimes they dont actually read what is in the add. I have come to this conclusion because I have just had two adds removed, the heading were:

holistic beauty facial - hull
and
deep abdominal massage - hull

Completely non sexual content as you would expect and yet they have been removed. Its no good emailing them as you get a standard reply.

My advice is to set up multiple viva street accounts with different email addresses and have one ad. set up within each. they dont like multiple adds on one account either.

Try that and see if it works.