talk to me about depression

[Spanky G]

massage and aroma therapy for depression... i don't mean the funky mood as a result of stress or trauma. i'm talking about depression as an illness, the kind that plagues a person throughout their lives and psychiatrists want to treat with drugs. for life.

i've poked around the internet and generally see that it hasn't been studied very thoroughly but looks promising. i'm wondering if any of you have any experience with this.

and, i want to know what you would do. if someone you love was diagnosed with chronic depression, would you stand behind the recommendation for long term drug therapy, or would you offer regular body work as an effective alternative? (with dr.'s approval, of course)

i can't help but be afraid of not only the possible side effects of psych. meds., but also the effects they can have on a person who decides they "feel better and no longer need them". the emotional ups and downs associated with that kind of behavior (however ill-advised, but unfortunately for our case, quite likely) terrify me. i don't want to experiment with something so serious, but i want to do anything we can to avoid what i see as an inevitable train wreck.

thanks for your help!

 

[Pompal 09.]

talk to me about depression

I am not an expert on this subject, at all. However as an initial reaction MT is not going to help chemical levels in the brain enough, in my opinion, to help someone severely depressed. I also think meds without talk therapy is not productive. Personally I would consider bodywork, regular exercise, chiropractic care, testing for vitamin levels, homeopathic care, and talk therapy a good start.

 

[Pompal 09.]

talk to me about depression

Massage/bodywork may be a helpful part of treatment for depression, but it is no substitute for competent medical care. As complementary care providers, we should be a positive part of the person's self-care, but in no case should we recommend changing/eliminating medications for mental/emotional problems. Such matters are FAR FAR FAR outside our scope of practice. It is highly unethical to pretend otherwise, or to indicate to clients that such a course of action may be advisable.

Perhaps the best course of action to take is to obtain the client's permission to contact their medical/mental health care provider(s). If those providers will discuss the case with you, you can share any relevant research you may have come across (be ready to provide them with a copy, or at least the citation information).

If you are unable to discuss the client's case with their medical/mental health care provider(s), you will simply need to do what you can with bodywork and encourage your client to discuss their medication questions with those folks.

 

[ERR0R]

talk to me about depression

While I believe massage, aromatherapy, energetic healing (such as Jin Shin Jyutsu & others) can work as part of the protocol for some individuals, those with severe depression need to have proper medical supervision, (plus possible medication) along with the right mental/emotional support from a professional, blood work for both investigating possible health conditions & hormone levels, etc.

Having a client who is dealing with this issue can be a challenge, but with the right referral network you may be able to direct your client toward the support they need.

Nutritional counseling may help, as can acupuncture & other alternative/complementary therapies, such as light therapy for those who suffer from SAD (Seasonal Affected Disorder)

Depression can have many underlying causes, so it's difficult to know what the best approach may be without the proper tests & know-how, or without the knowledge to know what is truly going on to benefit the person suffering from this condition. As Jason said, it is beyond our scope of practice as MTs to attempt to provide more than the support we are trained to perform.

 

[tessa.]

talk to me about depression

thank you so much for your responses!

let me clarify something though - i'm talking about my husband's depression and my concern for him as his wife, not an MT (which i'm not even that yet, just a student). i would never dream of advising a client regarding something so obviously outside of my scope of training. my husband is seeing a psychologist for talk therapy and i have been invited to join his session tonight. i wanted to get your opinion before i ask his therapist if she thinks it would be beneficial. he would also talk to his psychiatrist about it as supplemental therapy - or even see if his psychiatrist thinks it's safe to try as an alternative, sort of like a last ditch effort before committing to drugs - which he's scheduled to start next week. and yes - sunlight and exercise seem to effect his emotional state in a more extreme way than i see in myself...

again, thank you for you help. if his dr. recommends body work, i don't even plan on treating him myself. i'd look for a professional in the area... unfortunately though, i've had experience with local practitioners saying whatever they need to in order to fill an appointment, regardless of their qualifications - which is why i came here with the question first.

~~ i suppose i could have said all of that in my original post. not sure why i was trying to be so candid in an anonymous forum... i feel like i'm on eggshells with this whole situation and i find myself over examining every action - as if his depression has anything to do with me. i know it doesn't, but i can't escape the heavy feeling of responsibility. [sigh] i suppose this is more of an off-the-table topic.

thanks again

 

[smileyface234]

talk to me about depression

Laura,
Dealing with a partner who has issues with depression is not any easy thing to cope with. You may want to seek some support for yourself too, because many folks who are drawn to the healing arts seem to feel the need to "take on" the burdens of others, as though we could carry the load for them. With someone we are close to, the lines become even more blurred. While you may well be able to find a compassionate & capable massage practitioner, be sure to interview them & find out if they've worked with clients who are undergoing treatment for depression. You don't want to have someone who will in anyway undermine the medical professional your husband is already working with.

That said there are many avenues to help those with chronic depression, beyond seeing a psychologist who is doing talk therapy & medications. Seeing a medical doctor, perhaps a Naturopathic doctor, who will perform some basic blood work, to access your husband's nutritional levels & hormone levels etc could reveal an underlying physical cause for his depression. Chemical imbalances have often been determined as a cause & that should be checked out as well.

According to the following book: Prescription for Nutritional Healing (Which I personally think everyone should have a copy of! Most health food stores carry a copy for a reference guide) by Balch & Balch: There are 3 main types of clinical depression: major depressive disorder, dysthymic disorder, & bipolar depression. Within these types are variations. Causes are not fully understood and can be triggered by many things from tension, stress, a traumatic life event, a hyperstimulated immune system, chemical imbalances in the brain, thyroid disorders, nutritional deficiencies, poor diet, the consumption of sugar, mononucleosis, lack of exercise, any serious physical disorder, or even allergies. One of the most common causes of depression is often related to food allergies. Hypoglycemia (low blood sugar) is another common cause.

Heredity may be another significant factor. In up to 50 percent of those suffering from recurrent episodes of depression one or both of the parents also experienced depression.

The most common type of depression is a chronic low-grade depression called dysthymia. This condition involves long-term and/or recurring depressive symptoms which can keep a person from functioning normally & interfere with social interactions & enjoyment of life. Research has found that this often results from unconscious negative thinking habits. Double depression is a variation of dysthymia in which a person with chronic, low-grade depression periodically experiences major depressive episodes, then returns to his or her "normal," mildly depressed state.

According to the book I am quoting - these are some of their recommendations:

Essential Fatty Acids (such as Kyolic-EPA which contains salmon oil, flaxseed oil, or primrose oil)
Aids in the transmission of nerve impulses; needed for brain function
Take as directed with meals

5-HTP Take as directed
Increases the body's production of serotonin.
CAUTION ***Not to be taken with other anti-depressants***

L-Tyrosine Up to 50 mg per pound of body weight daliy on an empty stomach with 50 mg Vit. B6 & 100-500 Vit. C for better absorption.
Best taken at bedtime
Alleviates stress by boosting production of adrenaline. It also raises dopamine levels, which influences moods.
(look up amino acids for more info)
CAUTION ***Do not take tyrosine if taking an MAO inhibitor drug***

There are numerous other supplements recommended from this book - including Vit. B complex injections - These vitamins are necessary for the normal functioning of the brain & the nervous system. If depression is severe, injections under a doctor's supervision are recommended. Other extra B vitamins can be combined in a single shot and may help lift depression. Also Folic Acid is often found to be deficient in those with depression, as is Zinc
Calcium & Magnesium have a calming effect. Calcium is needed for the nervous system & Magnesium helps to reduce muscle tension, aids sleep, provides a relaxation effect, etc.

You can see from all this why I stated that working with a good nutritionist & or a Naturopathic Doctor can be very helpful, as a complementary part of the overall treatment for depression! As to medical end of things another reason to check out the physical issues involved is that hormone levels can be a big part of depression. Testosterone Deficiency in men can make them more prone to high blood sugar, high blood cholesterol & triglycerides, high blood pressure, obesity in general & abdominal obesity in particular...There are also factors related to heart disease, & depression when this natural hormone is lacking.

I hope all of this is of help to you & that your husband gets all the right help he needs. Best of luck & be sure to get the support you need as well!

 

[Brendan L]

talk to me about depression

thank you, riversinger. i didn't realize it until i read your reply, but that was exactly the kind of advice i was looking for. and thank you for helping me understand...

feel the need to "take on" the burdens of others, as though we could carry the load for them. With someone we are close to, the lines become even more blurred.

- you are very right.

 

[Rammie]

talk to me about depression

Depression is a toughy. I've dealt with it personally for 20 years. Here's what I've found...

Disclaimer...I am a doctor, but please don't take this as any official medical or chiropractic advice because I haven't had a chance to examine the person) This is just what I would start with....I apologize if this gets long-winded or boring LOL

I first have the patient fill out questionnaires. These questionnaires will help me assess which lobes of the brain are over- or under-firing, which hemisphere (right or left) is dominant or weak, which neurotransmitters (brain chemicals) are affected, etc. From there, I sit down with them and take a detailed history. What are they experiencing? When did it start? Is it constant or does it come and go? What makes it better? What makes it worse? Family/hereditary possibilities? Complicating lifestyle factors (stressful job, alcohol over-indulgence, poor diet, etc)?

By now, I have a pretty good idea of what lab work (usually blood draws) to order. These people typically need lab work, and lots of. Depression can be ANYTHING. A CBC can tell me if they have anemia; if they do, then a follow-up anemia panel can tell me what's causing it. It can be intestinal/stomach inflammation due to a food allergy, causing a Vitamin B deficiency, which leads to a tip in neurotransmitters and Boom, you have depression. Or, a lack of oxygen to the brain, which is a big deal with anemia, and that is why anemia is a big deal. It could be insulin resistance making brain cells go haywire, which causes them to malfunction and then depression hits. So I also take their glucose. I'm also going to run thyroid and adrenal work, because a hypofunctioning thyroid is a HUGE reason for depression. And I can do a salivary-based hormone panel to see if their hormones are excessive or insufficient, which is also a big cause for depression. All of this might run $600-800 or maybe a bit more, but then they have the CAUSE of the problem, and then they're not just treating their symptoms for life.

(The truth about many brain meds is that their whole mechanism deals with forcing, say, serotonin to remain in the synapse longer - the receiving cell responds by decreasing its sensitivity to that brain chemical - so now the meds are no longer effective and they have to switch. Or they'll tip the balance of one brain chemical, causing suppression of another, because they work in balance - so meds are OK for short-term, like a family death or something, but NOT GOOD long term.)

At this point, I put it altogether and come up with a diet, supplement, and exercise regimen for the person. I tailor the exercises (which aren't just a workout but also some mild lifestyle changes that make all the difference) to whichever brain hemisphere was deficient (usually the left, if the person is depressed and lacks initiative - if they're still creative, it means the right side is suppressing the left or the left somehow became weak, letting the right side go out of control), and check in with them in 1 week.

Personally, I was misdiagnosed with clinical depression and I have since learned that I am actually a Bipolar Type 2. Psychology was a former major of mine, with a focus on Abnormal Psychology, but I chose to go pre-med instead.

I know this got nerdy and technical...if anybody has questions, please feel free to PM me. I truly feel for anyone in this position - it hits near and dear to my own heart. But please do know that there is HOPE.

Hugs,
~Jyoti

 

[tahira]

talk to me about depression

I like how you wrote the question, got a few answers and then clarified it to be your husband, we got more information, better answers that way, I think.

My meager experience with aromatherapy: use bergamot, grapefruit, and that other one, the one that I can't remember right now. Best of luck.

 

[got_anesthetics]

talk to me about depression

wow, jyoti, that is awesome! why can't i find a doctor that will look at my husband's depression from this angle? when we went to see his psychologist, i asked about this kind of testing. she had referred him to a psychiatric nurse practitioner for a "medication assessment" and showed us the letter she sent to give DH's "treatment history". i asked her what we could expect from the medication assessment - how do they determine if he needs to be medicated? what kinds of tests will they do? she answered by holding up the letter/treatment history and saying "well, this plus whatever mike tells him during the assessment". WORDS. that's it. she unofficially diagnosed him with mood instability/bipolar disorder based on 4 (maybe 5) one hour sessions spread across 2 months. really? i expressed concern about jumping the gun with the meds - can't we look for something more tangible first? she told me we'd have to see an internist for that (internist??), but reminded me that this is my husband's decision and don't i want him to feel better? she's seen enough of this over the last 20 years to know meds will make him feel better. and the "prozac nation" and other bad press about dangerous side effects of psychotropic meds is totally blown out of proportion because that's the kind of news that sells. she compared it to "someone dying from an allergic reaction to antibiotics". i wanted to fly across the room and punch her in the face for that. i wanted to scream at her "i don't care how many patients you've seen have success with them - i only have ONE husband! how do we know it's safe for HIM!?!?!?"

he cancelled his appointment to see the psychiatric nurse practitioner and has not been back to see the psychologist. we're looking for a new one. (and i respect that this is his journey and am not meddling. he totally feels like she wasn't right for him and he doesn't want to jump to meds prematurely.) i'm trying to get him in to see the only "holistic" doctor i've been able to find, hoping he'll assess DH's health in the manner you described. but physicians don't advertise "holistic practices" around here. it's sort of frowned upon so you can only find out about them by word of mouth. happen to know of anyone in northwest indiana or chicago?

on the bright side - since then, and for a completely unrelated reason, we have become more strict about our diet and have been taking nutritional supplements - multivitamins, acidophilus and fish oil. his work has also picked back up. maybe it was work, maybe it's the supplements, but he's felt great for the last few weeks - better than he's felt in years. and not just "not depressed" - but "great". that's huge.

thank you so much for your kind words and insight!!

and the hug

 

[sbinlb]

talk to me about depression

Wow Laura, I'm sorry that's happening to y'all! Definitely not the most optimistic situation.

May I offer a ray of hope, an avenue to explore? What I described above is (hopefully) the future of medicine, which unfortunately isn't as widespread at this time as it should be. The way I practice isn't completely unique; is a bit scarce, but it can be found. You can get this kind of approach from several different angles...

1) An MD, DC, or DO, who practices Functional Medicine. http://www.functionalmedicine.org/about/whatis.asp (I'm in the DC category.) This is your BEST option (!) Doctors of this mindset can ALL come together, no matter what type of doctor they are, and unite together for the best interests of the patients. They believe in treating patients like individuals with unique needs and unique physiology. They believe in practicing preventive medicine, attempting to head off chronic disease at the pass so that drugs or surgery are not needed at all. And even in cases where chronic disease processes are under way, many times we can improve the person's overall physiology such that they can decrease or eliminate their medication and manage, minimize, or, at times, effectively reverse their condition.
2) An MD or DC who practices Integrative Medicine (this can be a gray area - many MD/DOs SAY they do "Integrative Medicine" to cash in on a certain niche market that also happens to be a lucrative demographic - since anyone can say so, find out how genuine they are by asking a few questions regarding their approach, how quick they are to prescribe meds, different treatment options, etc. It's your bodies and your money - you have a right to ask the hard questions ) Some Integrative practitioners really do want to integrate the natural with the conventional, while others simply practice the same ol' same ol' under a fresh new name.
3) A chiropractic nutritionist. (NOT a Registered Dietitican - RDs cowtow strictly to the faulty USDA food pyramid and are about as narrow minded as many conventional MDs) Many DCs will go on to practice nutrition or naturopathy either in addition to, or sometimes instead of, traditional chiropractic work. Some DCs have practices that are 100% nutrition - no personal injury work or back pain at all, but rather nutritional counseling only. Some of them are as good as someone who practices Functional Medicine.

Hope that helps! Please feel free to ask if you'd like more info - either on the public thread or via PM.
Hugs,
~Jyoti

 

[RoBb]

talk to me about depression

I have found through clinical studies and web research that Lemon oil is uplifting and anti-stress/anti-depressant. In a Japanese study, lemon essential oil in vapour form has been found to reduce stress in mice.[13] Research at The Ohio State University indicates that Lemon oil aroma may enhance one's mood, and help with relaxation. A great way to get the therapy of lemon is through a MIa Bell Lemon Verbena candle. Visit myscentedsoycandle.com for more information.