Seriously?

[thorn105]

I read this article and was surprised and disappointed. Mr. Barnes seems to have decided that science as we know it can not be valid. Is it because science hasn't corroborated his ideas?

http://www.myofascialrelease.com/articles%5CMFRArticleSinglePgs%201005.pdf?nav=mfr

I do fascial work myself and get good results, and I am okay with knowing that the precise mechanisms that enable those good results are as yet in dispute. Mr. Barnes seems to feel that unverifiable esoteric hypotheses are the preferred way to explain his work.

 

[strawberryfieldsforever]

Seriously?

Jason,

Ah, it was only time before this paper came up here on MassagePlanetL. The problem I have is that I do believe that he feels that the esoteric hypotheses in this paper ARE verifiable. You've spent some time on SomaSimple and have no doubt read through much of the past archives. This paper has been discussed at length there. Repeating a statement that "there is no such thing as a disease" is so porous that it calls into question credibility. Read through the paper. Ask for the research that backs up these statements. Hold that research up to the light and ask whether it is credible. Without a doubt there are many things that science has not shown or proved, but to tell a person with cancer that there is no such thing seems a cruel untruth.

 

[Pompal 09.]

Seriously?

You and I seem to agree. This paper is a major blow to Barnes' credibility.

When I go for more extensive training in MFR, I will study with someone other than Barnes. Fortunately, there are plenty of other highly-skilled practitioners to choose from.

 

[pureinsomniac]

Seriously?

Mr. Barnes seems to feel that unverifiable esoteric hypotheses are the preferred way to explain his work.

It also probably sells his classes/seminars/videos, etc. I am not sure who does his marketing, but they are brilliant.

I remember a few years ago, there was a John Barnes MFR seminar in Boston. Someone I know signed up and was in a hotel conference room watching on a big screen via satellite from another conference room where Barnes actually was. Oh, did I mention he was in the second added conference room. Which means Barnes sold out a room, but that wasn't enough so they added a second with a screen to watch on, which sold out, so they rented a third, with a screen to watch on...which again sold out. I am not certain on the number of people, but I vaguely remember my acquaintance saying he estimated between 300-400 people, maybe more at $400+ a pop...



I said to my acquaintance, "why not just buy his videos and watch at home"

The guy is a legend, I am sure he is brilliant at what he does...But aren't we all in our own way?

He is famous because of marketing, not necessarily because of being the "end all to MFR"

"there is no such thing as a disease"

That is just plain asinine. In my opinion, as I lost both parents to cancer. Disease is most certainly real. Perhaps his fame has made him a bit insane or eccentric, like Michael Jackson

 

[massage_junkett]

Seriously?

Saying there is no such thing as a disease is certainly far-fetched and ridiculous. But, it gets attention and isn't that what it is all about?

 

[Mollie SN]

Seriously?

Saying there is no such thing as a disease is certainly far-fetched and ridiculous. But, it gets attention and isn't that what it is all about?

There will be people who believe it too, because they want to and because maybe they feel like they have to swallow everything he says because they spent so much time and money on his programs.

 

[Monty Montezuma]

Seriously?

Bad publicity is better than no publicity? Haha.

Jason, that link doesn't work for me, but as I was Googling John Barnes (I don't know much about him or MFR in general) I came across this link which seems to go along with this thread:

http://lizditz.typepad.com/i_speak_of_dreams/2008/04/myofascial-rele.html

While I don't agree with everything that's in this blog post (I'm not sure how open-minded the author is), it gives some very fascinating links and information. The comments are also interesting and a little entertaining .

 

[lizi]

Seriously?

Ah, I see now... this isn't a new thread so the link is just old. I did find the article though. Funny how easily people will assimilate someone else's paradigm as their own, especially if it comes from someone with a well-known name with a few abbreviations behind it.

 

[kayclarkey]

Seriously?

I took a couple of John Barnes classes earlier this year and in the end while I was glad to have had the experience, I felt like I paid probably 3X more than I wish I had. Not only that but the majority of the material covered I had learned back in massage school (well, the material that is that could be backed up, though he repeatedly insisted that schools didn't teach us what he would).

To expand on the "no such thing as disease" line of thinking, he also told us that there was no such thing as menopause.

*waits a moment to let THAT one sink in*

So what is menopause? According to what we were told, menopause is an expression of symptoms of a neglected woman. Apparently if a woman receives MFR (including cranial work, specifically to the sphenoid to "milk" the pituitary gland if I recall correctly) then there's no reason for a woman to go through menopause...? Or something like that... Honestly, I stayed as open minded as I could get myself to be, but at some point my common sense had to cry uncle.

Also, if we questioned too much or wanted to see studies to back up some of his claims and support for his techniques, we were dismissed and told that we were thinking too much with the wrong side of our brain. That to be effective, we needed to work from our right brain. If we spent too much time in our left brain, we'd be held back.

t017

 

[Bethalee Alice]

Seriously?

The "no such thing as menopause" theory is new since I left the fold. That one should really get attention...again, isn't that the point?

One should always question. If there is no explanation, one should be honest and say so.

 

[Patricia G]

Seriously?

I have taken a lot of MFR courses, from a variety of teachers, including John Barnes and other of his teachers, Walt Fritz, Upledger and a few others.

Right from the first time I had MFR done to me I knew I had to learn it. I find that results are amazing for most people. And no, it doesn't seem to matter whether they 'believe in it' or not. From scoliosis at both ends of the age spectrum - the 13 year old has reversed enough now that they are not talking surgery any more - and the 86 year old no longer has her ribs resting on her pelvis and is straighter than she has been in over 12 years - to problems that are decades old that people have been told they will have to learn to live with - and get improvement in just a few sessions.

How does it work - I really don't know for sure although I have read many theories. Most of my patients don't care how it works either, they are just glad to have reduced pain and/or increased range of motion.

I have taken a lot of John Barnes' courses and learned a ton at them. I love the techniques, I love that there is no set protocol. You look at the whole body and go where the person has a need.

Will I take the more advanced courses? No, I don't plan to because it gets mixed up with a lot of spiritual stuff like looking for spirit guides. (I know some people like that but it is not what I am looking for.) Will I repeat some of the 'early' seminars - quite possibly, as you learn more every time you repeat.

I have taken three of Walt Fritz's seminars. If you get the chance, go to one. You will get great practical teaching, no ego, and none of the woo-hoo stuff. The treatment you get while practicing makes every seminar worthwhile! You go home with great techniques that you can begin using as soon as you go back to work.